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pisgahpro

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Hey Everybody! The 2018 Bootlegger 100 will be held on April 21st starting and finishing in downtown Lenoir, NC. We hope to see you there!

There are two routes available, 60 miles and 100 miles. Both routes start with a pavement warmup before entering the beautifully brutal hardpack dirt and gravel roads of the Pisgah National Forest. The 100 mile route includes 10,000 feet of climbing!

More information and a link to registration can be found here:

http://www.pisgahproductions.com/events/bootlegger-100/

bootleg 2018 april 21.jpg 


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thumper88

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Reply with quote  #2 
Any thoughts on tire selection? Seems like the climbing wants at least a nod to going lighter, but the crucial detail is always how likely the gravel bits are to cause sidewall cuts and pinch flats...
thanks in advance for even basic 411!!
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BrownDog

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Reply with quote  #3 
I have done it the past two years. Can’t do it this year as it is the week before Trans Iowa. First year I ran maxis ramblers and last year I ran panaracer GK 40’s. Measure 43. I like the panaracers better. I ran lower pressure and it helped on the down hill. I did not see any pinch flats or cut side walls. FYI Maple Sally is a BITCH!!
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thumper88

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Reply with quote  #4 
Thanks BrownDog, that's a solid start for my head scratching. Can you tell me if your goal for those two races was podium, just finishing, or somewhere in between?
And did you get a look at the range that other people were using?

I've actually got the Panaracer 43s but they are pretty hefty chunks of rubber. I also have MSO 36 tubeless and was considering those, or G-One 40s which are somewhat lighter, tho not as light as the Ramblers you used.
What was is about the Ramblers that didn't work for you?

In the photos Ive seen it doesn't look like full-on dirty kanza gravel, and Im a little concerned about trying to push big tires up those truly epic climbs...
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trippertim

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Reply with quote  #5 

Thumper88, I also rode it the last 2 years and have ridden Wilson’s Revenge and Maple Sally and Roseboro Rd on my own a few times. My favorite tire for the mix of pavement and the “normal” moderate gravel, and the hard pack descent off the BRP is also the Gravel King in the 40mm. I rode with a skinnier more aggressively knobbed Cx tire one year expecting more loose mud, but it was definitely overkill on the tread side and I really missed the volume of the bigger tire on the fast descent.  I don’t think I’ve ever seen a lot of large or sharp gravel on the route (like the stuff at the beginning and end of Southern Cross this year if you did that one) so I’ve not been worried about sidewall cuts.

 

All that said, no telling what gravel the Forest Service will spread in the next few weeks and there have not been many people finishing behind me the last two years at Bootlegger, so take any insights I give with a grain of salt [smile]

 

Looking forward to doing it again next month!

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trippertim

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Reply with quote  #6 
Just saw that you have the MSO 36's. I have those also and they ride nice, but at least for myself, I have not noticed a weight difference on the climb, but as far as traction / handling on the turns and the few steep kickers on non-paved sections I greatly prefer the Gravel King SK's.

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BrownDog

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Reply with quote  #7 
I have not been at the pointy end of a race in a long time and I am not a climber so my goal for a ride like this is to finish. Last year it was a training race for DK. I like the larger GK’s. You can run lower pressure and it will be helpful coming down the mountain from the parkway. You will find a lot of 90 degree turns with washout across the road. Last year I ran a Lauf fork and found it was well worth the weight penalty. I have spent a good bit of time riding the roads in that area. Maple Sally is no joke. The profile does not do it justice. For me the hardest part is the feeling of climbing the same climb over and over, You climb, go around a corner, go down a small hill then do it again on a section of road that looks just like the section you just finished.
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Zurichman

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Reply with quote  #8 
BrownDog and others I am in for this ride this year. The winter hasn't been kind to us here in Pa. I have the stock tires on my Roker Comp yet. Clement Mso 40 mm(now Donnley) I guess they will work for this ride or are the Gravel Kings SK's a better tire than this. There are kind of different models for this tire or am I just looking for SK's?  My question since I have never really done a ride that has rest stops. What kind of fluids and stuff do you guys carry on your bike?

Coming from Pa. should I be bringing a set of mud wheels with me? 

Thanks for any  help.
Zman

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If it was easy it wouldn't be a memory. You just hope you don't have all your memories in the same ride. been there dun that Zman
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thumper88

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Reply with quote  #9 
Quote:
Originally Posted by trippertim
Just saw that you have the MSO 36's. I have those also and they ride nice, but at least for myself, I have not noticed a weight difference on the climb, but as far as traction / handling on the turns and the few steep kickers on non-paved sections I greatly prefer the Gravel King SK's.



Trippertim, you mean the Sk's in 40mm (which on my wheels actually measure 43), right? as vs. say the SK's in 38mm.
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thumper88

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Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zurichman
BrownDog and others I am in for this ride this year. The winter hasn't been kind to us here in Pa. I have the stock tires on my Roker Comp yet. Clement Mso 40 mm(now Donnley) I guess they will work for this ride or are the Gravel Kings SK's a better tire than this. There are kind of different models for this tire or am I just looking for SK's?  My question since I have never really done a ride that has rest stops. What kind of fluids and stuff do you guys carry on your bike?

Coming from Pa. should I be bringing a set of mud wheels with me? 

Thanks for any  help.
Zman


You're almost certainly wanting the SKs. As to fluids, I usually run Skratch for stuff like this to start, then whatever they have at the stops, two 33oz zefal magnums on the bike, though these super size bottles probably overkill for a ride with multiple stops like this unless by a miracle its super hot.
Hopefully others who have done this specific course will weigh in, particularly on the mud wheels, which I have no thoughts on...

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trippertim

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Reply with quote  #11 
Thumper, I actually meant the 43 (they've changed the sizing around and I forget the exact numbers. Went and looked and it is the 43 which measure out pretty close to 43 for me. I've also run the 35's and been happy with them.
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BrownDog

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Reply with quote  #12 
Two bottles will be good with all the stops. The first year was very wet. I ran Maxis Ramblers with no problem,. The mud is not like DK or Landrun.
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Zurichman

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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrownDog
Two bottles will be good with all the stops. The first year was very wet. I ran Maxis Ramblers with no problem,. The mud is not like DK or Landrun.


BrownDog thanks for that info:

Would I be ok then with the stock Clement(now Donnley)mso 40 mm explor then instead of buying Panaracer Gravel Kings sk's?


Thanks
Zman

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If it was easy it wouldn't be a memory. You just hope you don't have all your memories in the same ride. been there dun that Zman
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thumper88

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Reply with quote  #14 

Hey
does anybody know which ridewithgps file is correct for the 100? The one posted for download on the race website doesn’t really gybe with the cue sheet or the Bible or the ridewithgps file or Strava segment at bottom of Bible.
I’d guess the right one is the one at bottom of Bible that when you kick it up on RidewithGPSis labeled “bootlegger 100 with BRP segment” but I hate to guess.
The one you've got up to download on the main page of the race site seems after the first bit to start being off several miles about where climbs start etc.
its a pretty big deal to have Maple Sally come 10 miles different from what you expect....

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Zurichman

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Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thumper88

Hey
does anybody know which ridewithgps file is correct for the 100? The one posted for download on the race website doesn’t really gybe with the cue sheet or the Bible or the ridewithgps file or Strava segment at bottom of Bible.
I’d guess the right one is the one at bottom of Bible that when you kick it up on RidewithGPSis labeled “bootlegger 100 with BRP segment” but I hate to guess.
The one you've got up to download on the main page of the race site seems after the first bit to start being off several miles about where climbs start etc.
its a pretty big deal to have Maple Sally come 10 miles different from what you expect....



hey thumper why don't you post it on their facebook page i get instant or almost instant results there. i can meet you at the start but no way i can ride the 100 miler. it was snowing or spitting snow here today with wind chills in the 30's i hope to be able to get one long ride in tomorrow and maybe a recon ride down there friday. i don't know where you live but we haven't had decent riding weather here in pa. i also am dealing with some collarbone nerve pain that doesn't like cold weather. pm if you want to get together friday nite or at the start line.

zman

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If it was easy it wouldn't be a memory. You just hope you don't have all your memories in the same ride. been there dun that Zman
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BrownDog

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Reply with quote  #16 
The last two years the course has been marked great. I will look to see what one I have. Mileage should be 109
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trippertim

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Reply with quote  #17 
Here is the RidewithGPS route I have had on my Garmin the last 2 years. Not sure if the turns at the very start and finish are correct, but once out from town, I think everything is correct. This shows it as just under 108 miles, but I've measured 109 each of the last 2 years. Can't wait for this weekend! And as Browndog said, each year, the course has been marked great.

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/18750094?privacy_code=QN0dXBaapWdE60V1
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pearl

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Reply with quote  #18 
I wont be able to swing this event this year, but is an easy gear of 34/28 not enough for either the 60 or 100 mile version? For reference, I did Love Valley Roubaix this year and wished I had more, not a lot more but just a little more.
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BrownDog

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Reply with quote  #19 
Ran a 34/32 last year. I will be running a 34/34 for Trans Iowa and will run the same next time I do the Bootlegger.
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Zurichman

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Reply with quote  #20 
i am heading to the bootlegger but with not lots of expectations other than trying to finish the 60 miler. my collarbone nerve pain has come back and have had that now for 24 hrs. tonight was a rather nice day here in the 50's but i didn't want to take a chance and make it worse. when i flew down to fl on 3/2 i had no problem until i got off the plane at bwi and hit the cold. i am hoping for the same results this weekend.

zman

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If it was easy it wouldn't be a memory. You just hope you don't have all your memories in the same ride. been there dun that Zman
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trippertim

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Reply with quote  #21 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pearl
I wont be able to swing this event this year, but is an easy gear of 34/28 not enough for either the 60 or 100 mile version? For reference, I did Love Valley Roubaix this year and wished I had more, not a lot more but just a little more.


I would say gearing depends on your legs and lungs, but no way I'd personally do the 100 miler with a 34/28. If you wanted a lower gear at Love Valley, you most likely want lower for Bootlegger, since they are in the same area and the terrain is similar. The 1st mile or so in particular once you get on Roseboro Rd for the 100 miler has a good kick to it and you can burn a lot of matches grinding too high of a gear and then have to ride the rest of the way to the Parkway before getting any break.

If you look at the race bible linked from the website, they highlight most of the steep sections.
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Zurichman

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Reply with quote  #22 
Well how did everybody do at the Bootlegger?

starting temps I think was around 44 deg. F and I started out with leg warmers/arm warmers/jersey/and a winter vest. My hands and feet were cold the first hr. Temps didn't higher than the 70's so really decent riding weather.

With not much training in I was quickly spit out the back and rode by myself most of the day. That was ok by me as I had a chance to ride my own pace and stop a couple of times for some pics. On some of the long climbs I had to stop a few times to take a break and not cramp up. The 38 tooth front gear work great on the bike on the nasty/steeper climbs.

The ride/race itself you couldn't ask for a better organized ride. All the turns were marked either with an arrow and or orange flagging tapping hanging from the trees before the turns and on stakes or hanging from the trees after the turn to assure you that you were still on course. They had 3 controls/rest stops on the 60 miler. The guy at the 41.7 one was way over the top cooking up grilled cheese sandwiches which for sure hit the spot. The burritos and beer at the finish line were great also. The first and last 10 miles were hard roads and so thought I would have a break coming in but it felt like 10 mph headwinds coming in and enough hills/climbs to keep you honest.

I finished 6th out of 7th in the over 60 group. One guy was 65 the rest were young kids at 60 & 61. I will be 67 tomorrow. Pretty sure I was the oldest finisher in the 60 miler but there might have been some older riders in the 100 miler. I would go back to do the 100 miler. I did get the feeling from talking to some of the riders that they were either mt. bike racers or cross racers and since this ride was close to them it was one of the gravel bike races they did each year.

A surprise to me is that the mt. bike riders that were going to the top of the mt. in their pick up trucks to ride would go blasting by me, making me eat dirt/dust. The people that weren't exercise people would slow down or a few even waited for me to pass which was pretty cool.

gun/total time

6:21:10

next up Farmer's Daughter in Chatham NY a month away and I should actually be able to train for a gravel ride/race for once.

Zman

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If it was easy it wouldn't be a memory. You just hope you don't have all your memories in the same ride. been there dun that Zman
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trippertim

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Reply with quote  #23 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zurichman
Well how did everybody do at the Bootlegger?

starting temps I think was around 44 deg. F and I started out with leg warmers/arm warmers/jersey/and a winter vest. My hands and feet were cold the first hr. Temps didn't higher than the 70's so really decent riding weather.

With not much training in I was quickly spit out the back and rode by myself most of the day. That was ok by me as I had a chance to ride my own pace and stop a couple of times for some pics. On some of the long climbs I had to stop a few times to take a break and not cramp up. The 38 tooth front gear work great on the bike on the nasty/steeper climbs.

The ride/race itself you couldn't ask for a better organized ride. All the turns were marked either with an arrow and or orange flagging tapping hanging from the trees before the turns and on stakes or hanging from the trees after the turn to assure you that you were still on course. They had 3 controls/rest stops on the 60 miler. The guy at the 41.7 one was way over the top cooking up grilled cheese sandwiches which for sure hit the spot. The burritos and beer at the finish line were great also. The first and last 10 miles were hard roads and so thought I would have a break coming in but it felt like 10 mph headwinds coming in and enough hills/climbs to keep you honest.

I finished 6th out of 7th in the over 60 group. One guy was 65 the rest were young kids at 60 & 61. I will be 67 tomorrow. Pretty sure I was the oldest finisher in the 60 miler but there might have been some older riders in the 100 miler. I would go back to do the 100 miler. I did get the feeling from talking to some of the riders that they were either mt. bike racers or cross racers and since this ride was close to them it was one of the gravel bike races they did each year.

A surprise to me is that the mt. bike riders that were going to the top of the mt. in their pick up trucks to ride would go blasting by me, making me eat dirt/dust. The people that weren't exercise people would slow down or a few even waited for me to pass which was pretty cool.

gun/total time

6:21:10

next up Farmer's Daughter in Chatham NY a month away and I should actually be able to train for a gravel ride/race for once.

Zman



Good job! I definitely recommend the 100ish miler. In my opinion the 100 is the much better course. The additional 47ish miles are almost all dirt and the few that aren't (except for 1 mile on Adako Rd) are on the Blue Ridge Parkway and are beautiful. The 60 miler cuts out the climb up Roseboro Rd to the Parkway, the descent back down off the Parkway and the Wilson Creek and Maple Sally loop, which I think is some of the best riding anywhere.

If you are available to travel, look at coming back down for the Wilson's Revenge race in the fall, which includes the Maple Sally and Wilson Creek (Brown Mountain Beach Rd) loop and part of the Roseboro Rd section, but in a 50 mile loop instead of throwing it at you inside a 100 miler :-) Also a great event put on by Pisgah Productions, so still well marked and great aid stations.

http://www.pisgahproductions.com/events/wilsons-revenge/
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Zurichman

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Reply with quote  #24 
trippletim Thanks This was only my 4th ride of the season as we have been having crappy weather here in Pa. and just now starting to have some decent spring weather. I would have to spend some time down in the dungeon(indoor training) or hope for better weather next spring to get the 100 miler in. I did look at the Wilson's Revenge link as I heard plenty or riders talking about it when I was down there. I wasn't paying close attention to Betsy's Store during that ride as I was shoving down some food there. Is there ample parking there for the ride start? The registration link isn't working on Active yet either to know how much the ride cost.

Zman

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If it was easy it wouldn't be a memory. You just hope you don't have all your memories in the same ride. been there dun that Zman
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trippertim

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Reply with quote  #25 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zurichman
trippletim Thanks This was only my 4th ride of the season as we have been having crappy weather here in Pa. and just now starting to have some decent spring weather. I would have to spend some time down in the dungeon(indoor training) or hope for better weather next spring to get the 100 miler in. I did look at the Wilson's Revenge link as I heard plenty or riders talking about it when I was down there. I wasn't paying close attention to Betsy's Store during that ride as I was shoving down some food there. Is there ample parking there for the ride start? The registration link isn't working on Active yet either to know how much the ride cost.

Zman


Plenty of room for parking there. There is an old CCC building with parking, a campground, a picnic area and lots of very close pull offs for fishermen in the area. Like any race out in the woods, if people can carpool that is probably best (and I'm sure that is what the team at Pisgah Productions recommends), and it isn't going to support a 3000 person race etc, but still ample parking for a race the size of Wilson's.

Interesting that they don't have the pricing up yet, but I'm sure by the time you would travel all the way from PA (flight or mileage and lodging / food), the race entry will be the minor expense, but lets not restart the whiny '"why do we keep paying DK so much money" thread here! [biggrin]
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